From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=872">Cryingshame58</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Injun Joe,<BR>
I appreciate your passionate explanation more than you know...Growing as a christian with the Episcopal faith, it taught me (as it has with others) to be more concerned about my own personality defect/sin than the sin of others...I have always adored the way the Episcopal Church welcomes and embraces anyone and everyone...It taught me to be more tolerant of others and to lend a helping hand to anyone that will not harm me....I believe strongly in what the Episcopal faith teaches as the holy sacraments and by only God's grace He has pulled me through dark days...I have experienced conflict in many aspects of my life and thought that nothing could surprise me...Now, this has surprised me....I have taught sunday school and believe in the teachings of the King James Version of the Holy Bible...I have to agree with you that it is wrong to ordain an openly gay, non-celibate bishop or priest...I am not against gay people...I have a few gay friends and I have welcomed my young adult children's gay friends in my home...I am not against liars, thieves, adulterers either...I have welcomed them all in my home, but I don't want any of those people to be ordained priests or bishops at my church....I think that a minister, priest, bishop or someone holding this kind of position in a church should be held in the highest reguard, have a fine character and practice what they preach....<BR>
CS58<BR>

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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=74">Echolocation</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

So you're putting gays in the same category as thieves, adulterers and liars?  As in "Oh yes, they're really nice people underneath, but I wish they'd stop doing those wicked things" ?<BR>
<BR>
Legality aside, do you make no distinction based on (a) gay isn't something you choose to be, but a thief or a liar is; and (b) thieves et al directly damage other people by their actions but gays don't?<BR>
<BR>
I wonder too whether your "few gay friends" are aware of your attitude?
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=872">CryingShame58</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Echolocation,<BR>
I believe that any kind of sex outside of marriage is a sin.  That one sin is not greater than the other.  Somehow you missed the point that when someone is ORDAINED to PREACH the same beliefs as me, I think they should practice what they preach...<BR>
CS58
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1269">Injun Joe</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

"A man does what he can until his destiny is revealed."<BR>
<BR>
 ~ The Last Samurai
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=660">Vishal</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

My dear Splat and B.K. thanks for that. Wrote it when it happened, couldn't find it in me to post it, being away from the blender in so long and all. Came home night of my birthday hammered, posted it then.<BR>
 Again, thank you. Calling you now Splatty.<BR>

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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=328">Rhetoric</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Laurel: <a href="/blend/wv.cgi?id=2003.12.01.11.48.5399">The Weak of Flesh</a>  hit me. I got it,  and its multiple meanings. Thanks.<BR>
<BR>
Rhet<BR>
<BR>

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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1269">Injun Joe</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Here is a link to a story about an old friend and former co-worker of mine... perhaps one of the most tragic and disturbing stories from my personal experience, which fuels my beliefs about homosexuality and "trans-gender" issues.  I find it hard to believe that anyone would support such actions and I am dismayed that such acts are allowed in any civilized society. <BR>
<BR>
<a href="http://www.dallasobserver.com/issues/2003-11-20/feature.html/1/index.html">http://www.dallasobserver.com/issues/2003-11-20/feature.html/1/index.html</a><BR>
 
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=902">spaded</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Kirk,<BR>
<BR>
I sent another e-mail (I was a victim...oh my).<BR>
I wasn't sure if I sent it to the right addy though, cause it seems to me that between the original e-mail you sent  about the shirts and the e-mail you gave on here there might have been two. So if you have two accounts dealing with this, check them both, it is there!! I put...T-shirt  spaded....in the subject line. Get back to me!<BR>
<BR>
Spaded
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1389">Poo Poo Kitty Farts</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

What an interesting debate, I like this site more and more.  Thank you Injun Joe for introducing this debate.  I agree... homosexuality is wrong.  These days there are few who are brave and un-PC enough to raise such a topic.  You go, Joe!  I posted a favorite Mark Twain quotation in your honor.
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1269">Injun Joe</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

PPKF -<BR>
<BR>
Thanks!
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=48">Laurel Ahlfeld</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

~*~Rhet~*~ Thanks so much! Glad you enjoyed it. 
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1385">Harmonica</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Aparajita..thank you..
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1120">Chances</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Jim - <a href="/blend/wv.cgi?id=2003.12.02.09.40.19788">Wires</a> - Wow. This was lovely. Well done.
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1269">Injun Joe</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Misti,<BR>
I NEVER said anything about AIDS being God's way of punishing gays....FYI.  AIDS is very much a result of unhealthy lifestyles, I am confident.  Uncle Bill Burroughs once postulated that AIDS was a laboratory creation unleashed on humans - I'm not gonna fall prey to that line of conspiracy theory.  I recently went to the M.D. for flu shots and such and decided to get immunized for Hepatitis A & B... the info they provided me noted that men who have sex with other men are at extremely high risk of contracting Hep B.  Kinda makes one THINK, doesn't it?  All I can say is I am glad I had the kind of upbringing and moral background to know better than to put my penis in some dude's mouth or poopershooter.  And I am a whole heck of a lot happier without all the trivialized/commercialized notions about sex now that I view abstinence as a wholly appropriate place to reside until I get married.<BR>
<BR>
To other readers/respondents let me just say...I used to ADORE pornography.  I can name loads of contemporary and vintage porn "stars," and used to maintain an extensive collection.  I assisted a writer galpal of mine with research on swingers conventions for a series of articles she wrote on "AIDS in the Age of Swingers," and went through a period in the 80s when I seriously considered writing/filming projects about where all the great porn stars had gone (but most of them had already died from horrific diseases or had been killed by pimps and drug dealers - go figure).  I was particularly "in" to vintage porn - old, silent stuff and nasty 60s/70s smut.  Oh yeah...and "erotica."  Even sought out copies of those early Playboys that I first plastered all over my consciousness with adhesive fluids.  I went through a cleansing, sort of an "aversion therapy" years later.  One writer commented on the Board that one's choice of what one consumes should be their own thing... but sadly, people do not consume porn - it consumes THEM.  But if your primary places of worship are bars and strip clubs, and if you are attracted to men and women with screwed up sexual psyches, then by all means keep fueling that billion dollar industry!  I'm always amazed by those few feminist/social worker/socially conscious gal pals of mine that are addicted to porn.  How sad.  Human beings are so much more special and sacred than that, in my opinion.  All I can attest to is that my own life has become so much more rich and sane WITHOUT all the smut and ugliness.  I'm just not much in to watching strangers f*ck, and I am DEFINITELY not in to lining the pockets of the scumbags that run that industry.  But then, I am one who also doesn't revere stars and celebrities and I am at peace in my own mind and normal lifestyle.  Alcoholics and sex abuse go hand in hand.<BR>
<BR>
To Julia Gianni (the name from that crappy VANILLA SKY flick...and the pseudonym of an old sex partner that likes to stalk me on this website) all I can say is this:  I am sorry you got so damaged by your adolescent life in one of the more anachronistic religions.  Just don't show your total ignornace by equating my religion (or others) with that of snake handlers and such.  It really shows a severe lack of understanding or intelligence, Laura.  But then, you were always the one who bragged about being the "condom dispenser" at work, right?  And by the way, I'd rather be a "90s Falwellian" than a 50s Burroughsian" any day.  Burroughs is dead, and at least Falwell stands for something greater than Uncle Bill's "nothing is true, everything is permitted" dystopic view of humanity.  Hell, even Burroughs didn't "stand" for that - he just used his wonderfully drug-induced creativity to write about such horrors...when in fact he led a fairly upright, moral and libertarian lifestyle.  Stick to things you know about, unless you want to look like an idiot (again).
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1269">Injun Joe</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Echo -<BR>
<BR>
Good replies above...wish we could hash that out over long chats at coffee, but I'll settle for a website.  Let me clarify a comment or two (in light of my admission of adoring "porn") - I simply propose that people give up that "right" to buy and view porn towards a greater goal of healing the world's sexual psyche.  I am strong enough in my own mind and morality to CHOOSE not to use the "porn drug" - call it a sacrifice.  Man, can you imagine masses of people actually SACRIFICING  something they love and value for a greater good?  Just give it up, walk away from it.  Rebuke it, if you like.  And I add to that extensive study and research ont he topic which now also makes me an advocate to such a prohibition...cause I am clear about just how damaging and immoral pornography is.  And absurd.  Tragic.  I was really kinda joking about you wanting to censor me, but frankly I'd be pleased and proud to be the guy to throw the switch on torching the whole lot of the world's collective porn.  Put a load of people outta work, and force millions of humans to get real in their worldview and in their relationships.  I always figured I was part of that 1/2 of 1% of people that could view porn without it affecting my mind and my relationships and that I would gladly give it up for a greater good of preventing that 90+ % of people who are damaged and warped each and everytime they view porn.  Like, what if it's removal could mean that ONE woman was to be saved from rape by the sicko that just did a 12 hour porn-a-thon and was so obsessed that he went out and raped the first woman he could subdue?  So that is really my challenge to all - just give it up, whether you agree or not.  And if you think you may actually have a sex addiction problem, get help immediately.  Not from some hillbilly shrink who would rather bone you on his/her sofa soap-opera style...but from someone with some decent credentials and with some greater sense of morality. 
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=161">Malu Lani</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Aparajita:  I really liked <a href="/blend/wv.cgi?id=2003.11.12.21.31.27951">winter blues</a> but you sounded so melancholy...To some it would be a blessing to be able to sit and do nothing at all...some people don't have a house to come home to, a TV to watch...OR a tasteless meal to eat.
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1103">ladyinwaiting</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

Malu Lani ~ nice to see you breeze through...praying that you have a lovely holiday season with many blessings...
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1176">aparajita</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

malu lani:  like a ghost you appear when least expected...  hmmm.  nice of you to visit and thanks for the comment.  that particular day was a melancholy one.  fortunately, i am the eternal well overflowing with optimism to stay down for very long.  thanks again.  like lady, i hope that you had a Blessed Thanksgiving and will make memories to cherish during the season of giving ahead.  God Bless You.
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From: <a href="/blend/av.cgi?id=1176">aparajita</a><BR>
Date: 2 December 2003<P>

malu lani:  i neglected to mention that you are so very right.  i am more thankful than i can express and have been Blessed beyond anything i have ever deserved or could earn.  i am acutely aware that there are those with far less; and, having been in that position a few times during my lifespan i am humbled to be reminded of it.  thank you.
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